meno pete i think i have the hinge that grounds the arguement, i asked my roomates, but they had no idea what i was talking about. one hasn't read plato, the other only read the meno once (i am about to embark on a sixth reading)... so "can you tell me, socrates, can virtue be taught? or is it not teachable but the result of practice, or is it neither of these, but men posses it by nature or in some other way?" if the first part of the dialogue shows us that meno does not know what virtue is, and the second demonstrates that one must reject their double ignorance and know that they dont know, then the third shows us what virtue is. if virtue is teachable then there are teachers of it, which there are not. if virtue is a gift from the gods, as socrates proposes, or if it is by nature then there can be no teachers and everyone would possess it innately. if virtue is obtained through practice than only the virtuous would know what virtue was. since meno gives flawed definitions and virtue can not be shown to be taught, then it is obvious that it is not knowledge nor do those who are not virtuous possess the knowledge of virtue. that means that not everyone has it, so it is not natural nor can it be a gift from the gods if hte gods are not virtuous, which the greek gods were not. thus the only option left is to say that virtue is practicable.. because only those who are virtuous can know what virtue is, and you can be taken to virtue through the process of dialectic because everyone has the potency (oh no aristotle entering plato, bad bad bad) to be virtuous, but they must first realize that they are not and then through practice follow someone who is virtuous, and through practice and dialectic become so. thus the philosopher king's education.... ack.. need to read meno again before setting out to write this paper. *at the third level of the line, in the state of hypotheses* 041022 ... autumn If you want to follow a vituous someone, who is it that you decide is virtuous? Because not even you can be sure. 041024 ... pete :) 041024 ... unhinged less meno mosso poco meno mosso lente slow meno forte meno piano meno less 041024 ... mourninglight *grins* 041024 ... pete this essay has ended itself "as if a gift from the gods" .. ahh atlast :) 041024 ... jane that's really funny because i just read the meno & wrote a paper on the apology & the gorgias what is your class called? 041024 ... pete "reason and revelation" 041025 ... jane that sounds a lot more interesting than my class 041025 ... pete what's yours called? i just printed off my paper, thinking of a title before getting out a cover page and stapling the essay not to see agin for weeks 041025 ... JdAwG Hmm...I think i had that once...I sounded like a frog, and it interfered with my driving. 041103 ... pete you mean mono, no doubt 041103 ... jane topics in the history of philosophy 041103 ... unhinged do you really want to know how i feel about you? do i really care if in the telling you stay away for good? 100706 what's it to you? who go blather from